Disconnects owing to mains broadband?

Help! It's the hair-bear bunch!

Moderator: larchy

Disconnects owing to mains broadband?

Postby Tonster on Wed Oct 10, 2012 3:51 pm

User avatar
Tonster
Moderator
Not Twisted, Toothpick or Tuff
 
Posts: 7682
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2003 12:36 pm
steamID: MartianLM
antispam1: No
orientation: Yes
Battle.Net ID: MartianLM#2136
Recently my Sky Netgear router died and I got another one from Sky, different make this time. In fact I got 3 as the first two were also faulty. Anyway prior to the router dieing I was running broadband through the mains. So the connections went;

BT phone socket --- router --- mains plug in kitchen by router ---- mains plug by pc --- pc.

All was well until the old router died. The new one seems to have a problem keeping me connected, it will drop momentarily anything from once every day to once ever 20 minutes. Enough of a disconnect to get me booted from a game server, disconnected from Diablo 3, disconnected from remote work logon, but it does come back damn fast.

However I have a looooong ethernet cable so tested this set up

BT phone socket --- router --- loooooong cable --- pc.

All is well with the world, except for the broken bones from tripping over the looooong cable.

So in short, why the fluff is the router dropping the connection periodically when it runs through the mains, or at least, how can I begin to find the problem? I have tried replacing all cables in the first set up shown. Sky have also tested all the line up to the house and BT have tested the line up to the main BT socket, all fine. Sky now refuse to help because the problem is clearly within my house (even though the only change was their router).

oh, and data load has no bearing, it will disconnect during a heavy download or sitting idle but logged in to something.

Re: Disconnects owing to mains broadband?

Postby LSM on Wed Oct 10, 2012 4:32 pm

User avatar
LSM
Forum Bicycle
Lazy Space Monkey
 
Posts: 6337
Joined: Thu Oct 09, 2003 9:12 am
Location: Milton Keynes
steamID: LSM
PSN: messele
AKA: Lt. Sex Machine
Twitter: messele
One thing I can think off offhand. Is one of the mains adapters plugged in upstairs and the other downstairs?

If that's the case then it may be because the two halves of the network are on a different ring main and that may mean there are RCCB's interfering with the connection in the fuse box.

How about your fridge / freezer? They can sometimes have a habit of dirtying the mains as the compressor starts and even if they are suppressed these can sometimes lose their effectiveness over time.

You can experiment with the above if they may be a factor.

Re: Disconnects owing to mains broadband?

Postby Tonster on Wed Oct 10, 2012 4:42 pm

User avatar
Tonster
Moderator
Not Twisted, Toothpick or Tuff
 
Posts: 7682
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2003 12:36 pm
steamID: MartianLM
antispam1: No
orientation: Yes
Battle.Net ID: MartianLM#2136
Yes, plugs are upstairs (office) and downstairs (kitchen), and probably are on different circuits as we had the whole house rewired about 18 months ago to modern standards. Not sure there's anything I can do about that :(

Fridge/freezer - Is the only way to test the theory by unplugging them? I know fark all about elastic trickery...

Re: Disconnects owing to mains broadband?

Postby LSM on Wed Oct 10, 2012 4:45 pm

User avatar
LSM
Forum Bicycle
Lazy Space Monkey
 
Posts: 6337
Joined: Thu Oct 09, 2003 9:12 am
Location: Milton Keynes
steamID: LSM
PSN: messele
AKA: Lt. Sex Machine
Twitter: messele
First thing I'd try.

Plug in both the adapters on the same floor and run that looooong ethernet cable to whichever. That'll help diagnose by elimination.

If you still have the same problem then, yeah, try unplugging the fridge for an hour.

Re: Disconnects owing to mains broadband?

Postby Cacker on Wed Oct 10, 2012 6:23 pm

User avatar
Cacker
Site Admin
4th floor ponce
 
Posts: 2801
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 7:01 pm
steamID: Cacker
PSN: Cacker67
antispam1: No
orientation: Yes
Have you checked for any firmware updates for your moe adapters ?

They pretty much all use the same chipsets, I used Devolo software to upgrade both Devolo and solwise units.
/Chairs

Cacker

Image

Re: Disconnects owing to mains broadband?

Postby Tonster on Sun Oct 21, 2012 1:14 pm

User avatar
Tonster
Moderator
Not Twisted, Toothpick or Tuff
 
Posts: 7682
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2003 12:36 pm
steamID: MartianLM
antispam1: No
orientation: Yes
Battle.Net ID: MartianLM#2136
LSM wrote:First thing I'd try.

Plug in both the adapters on the same floor and run that looooong ethernet cable to whichever. That'll help diagnose by elimination.

After some extended testing of this it looks like you might be on to something there guvna. Plugging in the long cable to a mains socket in the downstairs hallway and I get no disconnects. As as soon as I move it upstairs I get random disconnects.

I therefore see 3 solutions
- plug in downstairs
- get the mains rewired so 1 socket upstairs is on the downstairs circuit
- try a different router as the previous one worked fine

Also just realised I haven't looked into what Cacker suggested.

Re: Disconnects owing to mains broadband?

Postby LSM on Sun Oct 21, 2012 6:49 pm

User avatar
LSM
Forum Bicycle
Lazy Space Monkey
 
Posts: 6337
Joined: Thu Oct 09, 2003 9:12 am
Location: Milton Keynes
steamID: LSM
PSN: messele
AKA: Lt. Sex Machine
Twitter: messele
Yeah try what Cack said as I've no actual experience of using mains networks, had no idea you could update firmware, but I do know a bit about household wiring and the workings of RCCBs. If it does prove to be traversing the two mains rings that is the issue then installing a spur as you suggest is unorthodox and not normally recommended but would obviously solve the issue.

Re: Disconnects owing to mains broadband?

Postby Squigg on Sun Oct 21, 2012 10:15 pm

User avatar
Squigg
Forum Guru
Capitalist pigdog
 
Posts: 1215
Joined: Thu Sep 11, 2003 1:18 pm
steamID: squigg
surely going to the effort of installing a mains spur is a bit drastic - may as well run an ethernet cable?!

Re: Disconnects owing to mains broadband?

Postby LSM on Mon Oct 22, 2012 8:50 pm

User avatar
LSM
Forum Bicycle
Lazy Space Monkey
 
Posts: 6337
Joined: Thu Oct 09, 2003 9:12 am
Location: Milton Keynes
steamID: LSM
PSN: messele
AKA: Lt. Sex Machine
Twitter: messele
This is no place for common sense reasoning!

Re: Disconnects owing to mains broadband?

Postby Cacker on Mon Oct 22, 2012 10:57 pm

User avatar
Cacker
Site Admin
4th floor ponce
 
Posts: 2801
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 7:01 pm
steamID: Cacker
PSN: Cacker67
antispam1: No
orientation: Yes
Hmm, I've had the ethernet over mains working over different ring mains, shouldn't be a problem :(
/Chairs

Cacker

Image

Re: Disconnects owing to mains broadband?

Postby LSM on Tue Oct 23, 2012 10:42 am

User avatar
LSM
Forum Bicycle
Lazy Space Monkey
 
Posts: 6337
Joined: Thu Oct 09, 2003 9:12 am
Location: Milton Keynes
steamID: LSM
PSN: messele
AKA: Lt. Sex Machine
Twitter: messele
Yeah all would depend on what hardware sits in the consumer unit Cack, many homes still have either fuse wire cartridges or resettable breakers and these are unlikely to be a problem, some RCCBs are fine too but other designs can interfere with the signal. There's no way of being sure of reliability apart from trying it I would think.

Re: Disconnects owing to mains broadband?

Postby The-Bandido on Mon Nov 05, 2012 10:21 pm

User avatar
The-Bandido
Forum Regular
 
Posts: 534
Joined: Fri Oct 10, 2003 12:03 pm
Tonster wrote:I therefore see 3 solutions
- plug in downstairs
- get the mains rewired so 1 socket upstairs is on the downstairs circuit
- try a different router as the previous one worked fine


You forgot #4 - just don't use "ethernet over mains". It's simply a bad idea. Install some decent Cat5 between upstairs and downstairs, with a switch if necessary.

An isolating transformer (or UPS) might also be worth using if there are significant ground currents between the two circuits - or run *both* an ethernet and mains cable upstairs.

Re: Disconnects owing to mains broadband?

Postby Tonster on Tue Nov 06, 2012 12:57 pm

User avatar
Tonster
Moderator
Not Twisted, Toothpick or Tuff
 
Posts: 7682
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2003 12:36 pm
steamID: MartianLM
antispam1: No
orientation: Yes
Battle.Net ID: MartianLM#2136
Your words look like English, feel like English, but yet somehow it's Chinese :oops:

Why would plugging broadband into my cat help, and what do you have against cats (5 of them no less!)? I have an optimus prime transformer in the attic but once again, I fail to see how it helps. As for ground currents, I don't live in the ocean so np there. Or are we talking fruit?

You seem to be mistaking me for someone who has the first clue where to plug his mouse in (would that be the cat again?). Do I need to buy a dog and get it delivered via UPS?

And besides, what's wrong with my existing cable-o-death-on-night-toilet-visits-atron (patent pending, name may need a little work, I think the words 'ninja' and 'plummeting down the stairs' need to be added somewhere).

I remember when all this were fields...

Re: Disconnects owing to mains broadband?

Postby Cacker on Wed Nov 07, 2012 11:22 am

User avatar
Cacker
Site Admin
4th floor ponce
 
Posts: 2801
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 7:01 pm
steamID: Cacker
PSN: Cacker67
antispam1: No
orientation: Yes
Is this an old house. If just moved into a new build with ethernet over mains working over 3 floors (all on different ring mains) no problem.

So I'm not sure the consumer unit would be causing any issues.

I'd be tempted to get an electrician to check out your wiring :)

I know house wiring isn't designed to cater for ethernet over mains, however does sound like something is interfering when it shouldn't.

Are you plugging the units directly into a wall socket or an extension lead. I've seen an issue where an extension to a summer house would drop occasionally when it was plugged into an extension board and the connection was a lot more stable when it was plugged into the wall.

Lay ethernet cable ? really. Who'd do such a thing ? Very victorian ... :E
/Chairs

Cacker

Image

Re: Disconnects owing to mains broadband?

Postby Tonster on Wed Nov 07, 2012 1:12 pm

User avatar
Tonster
Moderator
Not Twisted, Toothpick or Tuff
 
Posts: 7682
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2003 12:36 pm
steamID: MartianLM
antispam1: No
orientation: Yes
Battle.Net ID: MartianLM#2136
Cacker wrote:Is this an old house.

Not especially, and it was completely rewired about 18 months, new consumer unit, new sockets, everything.

Cacker wrote:Is this an old house. I know house wiring isn't designed to cater for ethernet over mains, however does sound like something is interfering when it shouldn't.

The most frustrating part is that it worked fine for nearly 18 months, then the router went the way of the dodo, and now the connection drops periodically with the new router which is a different model (right from day 1 with the new router).

Cacker wrote:Are you plugging the units directly into a wall socket or an extension lead.

Tried both, no difference.

Cacker wrote:Lay ethernet cable ? really. Who'd do such a thing ? Very victorian ... :E

That sounds like DIY, I don't do DIY :P

Re: Disconnects owing to mains broadband?

Postby Cacker on Wed Nov 07, 2012 5:55 pm

User avatar
Cacker
Site Admin
4th floor ponce
 
Posts: 2801
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 7:01 pm
steamID: Cacker
PSN: Cacker67
antispam1: No
orientation: Yes
Well, if you put it like that, it can't be anything to do with your mains, unless you've recently plugged something dirty into the mains ? Are you using porn-over-mains ?

Okay so from what you said, tonst, it looks like its the router. But you said in an earlier post, if you bypass the ethernet over mains, it works fine no disconnections, which moves the pointy finger of blame to the ethernet over mains.

c'est strange.

Too late to send the router back ?
/Chairs

Cacker

Image

Re: Disconnects owing to mains broadband?

Postby Klors on Wed Nov 07, 2012 6:47 pm

User avatar
Klors
Forum Guru
Would fuck the antichrist
 
Posts: 3970
Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2004 7:34 pm
Location: Lincoln, UK
Unless it's the router that has a dodgy power supply...
Klors Trofobik


Return to Technical Support

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests

cron